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Thread: How would you feel if your God lied about you?

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peregrine View Post
    Ezekiel 14:9, and Second Thessalonians 2:11 are prime examples. Although 2Thessalonians is Greek.



    Do you mean, "where did Yahweh deceive them?" That wasn't the point. Asherah; Baal; Chemosh; Dagon; Moloch, and some seventy deities were all given by El Elyon to the Canaanite/Mesopotamian nations. Please do some research into this pantheon.

    lets not forget Mot - god of death.

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  3. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    You know Pilgrim, that I personally like you. I don't mince words and I don't have favourites for which I change the truth if hard. I don't have those I give "thanks" to because I like them and I don't refrain from "thanking" posters who wrote a good piece although we otherwise lock horns. I judge a post by what is said not by if I like the poster or not. But know I am fond of you. You have a better mind than most unbelievers in Jesus, the Son of God, God incarnate.
    Brother52 is a good fellow, I agree.

    knows his stuff too.

    carry on..........

  4. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by John53 View Post
    Why would Yahweh lead someone through deception into a ditch of unbelief?
    ask Ramses 2..............oh ya he is dead now.

    lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mattathias View Post
    I'm not being cryptic. I gave you the exact date when it occurred. The names of both parties involved in the incident have been mentioned.

    P.S. I can even give you the exact time of day it happened: 11:37 a.m. EST.
    can you provide a direct link (I'm lazy).

    just am. sorry.

    would like to discuss the particulars if you can help me out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gaffo View Post
    can you provide a direct link (I'm lazy).
    Yes, but I'm not going to do it.

    would like to discuss the particulars if you can help me out.
    I don't want to discuss the particulars. I want to discuss how to render assistance to a person this has happened to.
    The hound of Jewish monotheism.

    "For us there is one God. He is the Father." (I Corinthians 8:6)

  7. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mattathias View Post
    Yes, but I'm not going to do it.
    ok, your right.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mattathias View Post
    I don't want to discuss the particulars. I want to discuss how to render assistance to a person this has happened to.
    ok, guess that leave me out.

    carry on.

  8. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    Hi Pilgrim,
    You conveniently left out vs.10
    [10] And they shall bear the punishment of their iniquity: the punishment of the prophet shall be even as the punishment of him that seeketh unto him;
    Hi, MM501.

    Thanks for providing Ezekiel 14:10. Who is it that provides the punishment? Who is it that deceives the prophet? I was trying to extend an olive branch by leaving out verse 10. It does nothing but "blame the victim(s)."

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    There are many forms of punishment for iniquity.
    Being deceived by God is one of them.
    "I the LORD have deceived that prophet" (who can argue with that plain truth?)
    If YHWH deceives - how can the recipient of that deception be at fault? It is 'blaming the victim.'

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    But at the heart of the matter is this is a form of punishment.
    Some people think God is unjust because they don't like the form of punishment.
    Is being deceived by *God* a form of punishment? If so, it would be no wonder some think *God* unjust. As if the SUPREME BEING couldn't figure out a better way to correct people than lying to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    (paraphrasing a scenario in 1 Kings 22) "I'm a wicked sinner, I want to hear God tell me that I should go to war"
    God's response "Fine, you are going to die today anyway for your sins, let's do it your way"
    Try this paraphrase: Yahweh wants to know how to deal with a disobedient prophet. Yahweh calls a board meeting and one of the members says, "Hey, here's an idea, I will go and be a lying spirit." Yahweh agrees to the deception.

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    Pilgrim, correct me if I'm wrong but you don't come across to me as one that believes Yahweh is the one true God.
    Correct. All anyone needs to do is examine the pantheons of Mesopotamia and Canaan. The syncretism with later Hebrew ideas clearly comes across in the Tanakh. Especially, Deuteronomy 32:8, 9.

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    You seem to have spent considerable effort and time trying to discredit the idea that scripture is the truth and a considerable amount of time studying every god under the sun.
    Comparative mythology/religion is fascinating.

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    If Yahweh happens to be the one true God and He decides to lead you through deception into the ditch of unbelief so that in your heart you are convinced that He is not God (and so fulfill the need you have expressed to have your point proven), then what's the problem?
    Nice twist on Pascal's Wager. The problem isn't whether YHWH deceives me. The problem is whether or not such a deity exists in the first place, and furthermore, whether or not, as you phrase it, "[If] Yahweh happens to be the one true God."

    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    Would you expect Him to reveal the truth to you? Does He owe you that much?
    Do the words of Jesus apply only to his original audience, or should those who claim to be Christians also be included? I ask in light of John 16:13 KJV, "Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come."

    Has this happened? No. Christians don't agree on even the most basic dogmas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gaffo View Post
    lets not forget Mot - god of death.
    Good one, gaffo. Whenever I think of Mot, I am reminded of Mott's applesauce. Mot, of course got subsumed into the later Hebrew deity, YHWH.

    "The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up." (1 Samuel 2:6 KJV)

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    Quote Originally Posted by MM501 View Post
    We differ in opinion.
    That's obvious which is why I asked you about it. Maybe how you can explain to me how I'm wrong thinking God leading people into pits of deception is contradictory to Jesus saying the lost sheep should be found and looked after?

    Okay
    Well I read it all and it starts off with Paul beating his own drum then going into a homophobic rant which tells me more about Paul than either God or unbelievers.
    And the officer said, "better get a lawyer son, better get a real good one".

  11. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by John53 View Post
    That's obvious which is why I asked you about it. Maybe how you can explain to me how I'm wrong thinking God leading people into pits of deception is contradictory to Jesus saying the lost sheep should be found and looked after?
    There is a difference between a lost sheep and a wolf.

    Well I read it all and it starts off with Paul beating his own drum then going into a homophobic rant which tells me more about Paul than either God or unbelievers.
    Not sure how you got any of that from ch.1 vs.18-21?

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