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Thread: The Best Threads I've seen lately are from an atheist.

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    You ask me to explain something God wrote a book to explain? You are entertainment for me and I enjoy challenging you. Lighten up.
    At least you're honest enough to admit it; and that you believe God writes books.
    For when nothing can be as it is, then whatever is turns into nothing. Yehushuan

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen T-B View Post
    Am I glad for you?

    As it brings you comfort, yes. (I have no reason to wish you dis-comfort).
    Thanks Stephen and you also.

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  4. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    I cannot speak about religious people. I can only address the Christains. First, the evidence we have for God, for those who walk with Him, is outside of the Bible. And we have it in spades. So I had to chuckle at your assumption that we have none. I have lots and lots and sometimes every day.
    Yes, as you said, "...the evidence we have for God, for those who walk with Him...". You see through the eye of faith. And that's fine. An atheist believes what can be obviously observed.
    I'm happy that we agree on something.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    Second, it is actually the atheist who is in the weak position which explains why they call us liars at every turn instead of offering evidence. We offer our evidence and the response is quite emotional as though they have a lot at stake. Some wonder what so many atheists are here if God is of no consequence. Why do they bother to post so much? Why are they so abusive and defensive? The answer is because they stand on no ground and are trying to defend something of very great consequence...the world view and assurance that they will never face judgement for the deeds done in the body.
    The skeptics and atheists here seem for the most part very civil and rational. Certainly not "quite emotional". Though I can imagine one could get frustrated talking to people, stating one's point plainly and in different ways, and not getting through. Nonetheless, most of the skeptics here seem to make their point succinctly and without excessive emotion.
    It is the Christians here who seem to respond as though they feel threatened.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    In the end which is worse, believing Someone is not there and they are, or believing Someone is there and they are not? If Christians are wrong, then they went through their lives with false hope loving others as they love themselves. If an atheist is wrong, he never enjoyed our hope and faces grave consequences for being wrong.
    This is an argument based on fear and the threat of punishment.
    This is not the gospel of Christ.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    The atheist loses something that is real and of greatest value if he is wrong and the Christian loses something that was fake if wrong. What is more, the Christian will not know he was wrong. They atheist will know it and regret it bitterly. Which is the greater risk?
    This also is an argument based on a threat of eternal conscious punishment, based on a popular Christian teaching which I consider to be not only to be opposed to the gospel, but Biblically unsupported.
    Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!

    2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."

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  6. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zathrus View Post
    Yes, as you said, "...the evidence we have for God, for those who walk with Him...". You see through the eye of faith. And that's fine. An atheist believes what can be obviously observed.
    I'm happy that we agree on something.
    Except that many of those who walk with God were atheists at one time. They saw. This is in general a problem in that atheists do not see what we see. Your claim is we do not see but you cannot know what we see. We know you do not see and can say you do not see.
    The skeptics and atheists here seem for the most part very civil and rational. Certainly not "quite emotional".Though I can imagine one could get frustrated talking to people, stating one's point plainly and in different ways, and not getting through. Nonetheless, most of the skeptics here seem to make their point succinctly and without excessive emotion.
    I can easily round up the posts the atheists write and they are sometimes very foul. This is another case of you not seeing what is there. ANd definately emotional. The words they choose are seldom non-emotional and when emotional insulting. I could show you but the effort would be most unpleasant. Sometimes believers are insulting but no one is as insulting as the atheists. One can see why. They do not believe it matters how they treat others. The second largest group are the Calvinist/OSAS believers who think it doesn't matter how they treat others. This also makes sense.
    It is the Christians here who seem to respond as though they feel threatened.
    No this is not true for the most part. But I notice you do not offer to go through and show this. You make the statment with no willingness to show us.
    This is an argument based on fear and the threat of punishment.
    This is not the gospel of Christ.
    I do not know a single believer who is afraid of the threat of punishment. No one. You got one? Let's talk to them. Because I do not believe any Christian is afraid of punishment and so is aggressive in their posts. This actually is totally illogical.

    This also is an argument based on a threat of eternal conscious punishment, based on a popular Christian teaching which I consider to be not only to be opposed to the gospel, but Biblically unsupported.
    Well, it is definately the knowledge that Jesus communicated to men and he ought to have known the truth. We feel like we are telling men speeding towards the end of the cliff and the drivers tell us we are threatening them. Drive on, I guess.
    ------------------------
    "He has shown you, O man, what is good and what the Lord requires of you. But to do justly..and to love mercy...and to walk humbly with your God."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    Except that many of those who walk with God were atheists at one time. They saw. This is in general a problem in that atheists do not see what we see. Your claim is we do not see but you cannot know what we see. We know you do not see and can say you do not see.
    No. Reread my posts. My claim is that you do see, through the eye of faith. You don't need to interpret that from something I wrote, I stated it plainly.
    I do not view the fact that atheists believe only what can be obviously observed as a problem. It is what it is.
    I don't know how you can know what I see or don't see.
    Yes, many who now are Christians were atheists before, and many who are now atheists were Christians before. People are not static. We are all on a journey.
    Some of my former coworkers who I've known for over 20 years were non-religious many years ago, and liked staying out late and raising hell at a pub after work, but when they reached middle age, several of them were evangelical Christians and trying to convert more of their coworkers.
    And on the other hand, one of the fellow musicians who I used to play together in a Christian rock group with in the 1990s is now an atheist.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    I do not know a single believer who is afraid of the threat of punishment. No one. You got one? Let's talk to them. Because I do not believe any Christian is afraid of punishment and so is aggressive in their posts. This actually is totally illogical.
    My statement that you are responding to here was in response to this claim of yours:
    In the end which is worse, believing Someone is not there and they are, or believing Someone is there and they are not? If Christians are wrong, then they went through their lives with false hope loving others as they love themselves. If an atheist is wrong, he never enjoyed our hope and faces grave consequences for being wrong.
    You said nothing about Christians being afraid of eternal punishment here, nor did I in my response. That is another subject, which I'll gladly discuss with you in another thread.
    My point is your argument above is that atheists should believe just in case they are mistaken and there is a God waiting to judge them and send them to hell. That is an argument based on scaring someone with the possibility of an afterlife of punishment.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dottie View Post
    We feel like we are telling men speeding towards the end of the cliff and the drivers tell us we are threatening them. Drive on, I guess.
    This is exactly what I stated in my first post in this thread, which you have tried to refute. You have even done me the kindness of making my point clearer yet by using this analogy. Thankyou.
    I'm very glad that we've now come to agree on this.
    Establishing the law by receiving the righteousness which is by faith, without the deeds of the law!

    2 Cor 3 "11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious."

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    The skeptics and atheists here seem for the most part very civil and rational. Certainly not "quite emotional". Though I can imagine one could get frustrated talking to people, stating one's point plainly and in different ways, and not getting through. Nonetheless, most of the skeptics here seem to make their point succinctly and without excessive emotion.
    It is the Christians here who seem to respond as though they feel threatened. Zathrus
    I agree, and why I started the thread in the first place.
    "The mind is like a parachute; it functions only when it is open." Coe

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmldn2 View Post
    So far the most interesting, qualitative, meaningful posts within the last couple of weeks on this site have been started by an atheist..
    i welcome discussion - this forum has not offered it the last 2 yrs.

    please point me to those threads by atheist(s) you refer to in this post.

    I'd like to view those threads myself.

    how are you doing Judy? well i hope.

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  11. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philip View Post
    First of all, atheists may generally be better people than believers.
    not so.

    a person is not defined by their beleifs, but their character.

    which stands outside (above) one's beleifs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Philip View Post
    They certainly are no worse.
    they are the same. some are good folks some are not.


    [/QUOTE]
    Secondly, has it occurred to you or anyone for that matter - that atheists here are most generally former believers?[/QUOTE]

    must disagree again.

    many of us were born in families that were Atheistic long before we were born.

    I'd say its 50/50 myself.


    [/QUOTE]

    Many times I find atheists knowing the bible better than believers do....and they are certainly not as hung up on certain issues. Additionally, I find that atheists tend to be much more rational in their thought processes and more logically expressive.[/QUOTE]

    agreed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmldn2 View Post
    I have absolutely nothing against atheists. I disagree with their not believing in God. Other than that, as far as I'm concerned, they are people just like you and me Philip. The only reason to call them atheists is because they call themselves that.

    As for being better people than believers, I do not categorize (if I can help it) people based on belief vs unbelief. To me a person's "character" speaks through their words, how they treat others much more than what they believe or don't.

    I'm just so disappointed in how that love we Christians are suppose to have and to show to others is absent from many Christians' posts.
    Agreed fully. and thank you for mentioning Character.

    your's is tops IMO.

    -though you are full bore wrong WRT to the Israeli-Palestinian troubles......you are on the wrong side of Right in that particular, but knowing your character is good, you are just ignorant of the particular issues............I've no doubt if you were more informed you would be on my side in that particular.

    I hope one day you will inform yourself on that matter and be on my side.

    ----------in all other things you and I are on the same side..........with all others of good character.

    peace Madam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jmldn2 View Post
    It is not God who hates everyone other than Christian or Jew. It is double-minded people, sanctimonious people, pious people, prideful people. God wishes for all to be in a relationship with Him.
    yep.

    sadly.

    not to leave out same minded Athiests.............those that hate Beleivers.

    thats not me - but some Athiest do.

    their character needs serious work. (self reflection would be a start to a remedy).

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