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Thread: Hebrews 1- the Context Trinnies Ignore!

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    Default Hebrews 1- the Context Trinnies Ignore!

    Let's take 'em 2 or 3 at a time~

    Heb 1:1- God, having of old time spoken unto the fathers in the prophets by diverse portions and in divers manners,
    2- hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in His son, whom He appointed


    > NOTICE: APPOINTED, not God spoke thru another God?Person/Nature/Essence<


    heir of all things, through


    > NOTICE: THROUGH. God didn't do it directly. <


    whom also he made the worlds;
    3- who being the effulgence [def= radiant splendor : brilliance] of
    His glory, and the very image of His substance, and upholding all things by the word of His power,


    > NOTICE: He is an image of God, as many sons are of their fathers. He is not one of Three. It's by God's Power! Not his own that he "upholds all things".<


    when he had made purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
    The INSANITY of CHURCHianity! Unequaled in All Religion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theQuestion View Post
    Let's take 'em 2 or 3 at a time~

    Heb 1:1- God, having of old time spoken unto the fathers in the prophets by diverse portions and in divers manners,
    2- hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in His son, whom He appointed

    > NOTICE: APPOINTED, not God spoke thru another God?Person/Nature/Essence<
    In his disclosure of the one God, Jesus reveals a hierarchy of function among three separate and distinct divine persons/agents, each person/agent being God in fullness and equality:

    God the Father authors and decrees the plan of salvation.
    God the Son executes the plan.
    God the Holy Spirit applies the benefits of the plan (which Holy Spirit indwells all the born again).

    Jesus presents the Son as subject to the Father, for the Son is sent by the Father in the Father's name (Jn 5:23, 36, 43); i.e.,
    acting as the Father's agent:
    speaking the Father's words (Jn 12:49-50, 14:24),
    doing the Father's works (Jn 4:34, 5:36, 10:25, 17:4), and
    bearing witness continually to the One who sent him.

    He likewise presents the Holy Spirit as subject to the Father, for the Spirit is sent by the Father in the Son's name (Jn 14:26); i.e., as Jesus' deputy, doing Jesus' will, acting with his authority as agent, representative and witness of Jesus, just as Jesus acted as the Father's agent.

    He also presents the Holy Spirit as subject to the Son, for the Spirit is sent by the Son (Jn 16:7) "from the Father" (Jn 15:26).
    As the Father sent the Son into the world to act as his agent, so the Son sends the Spirit into the world (Jn 16:7) to act as his agent.

    Jesus reveals three distinct and separate (one being sent by the other) persons/agents in the one triune God, the heart of the Christian faith in God--God the Son doing the will of God the Father, and God the Holy Spirit doing the will of God the Father and God the Son--each God in fullness and equality, yet with a hierarchy of function and authority among them.

    Feel free to also exegete these Scriptures of "Jesus - the Texts that Non-Trinnies Ignore!"

    heir of all things, through

    > NOTICE: THROUGH. God didn't do it directly. <
    Execution is the function of God the Son.

    whom also he made the worlds;
    3- who being the effulgence [def= radiant splendor : brilliance] of
    His glory, and the very image of His substance, and upholding all things by the word of His power,

    > NOTICE: He is an image of God, as many sons are of their fathers. He is not one of Three. It's by God's Power! Not his own that he "upholds all things".<
    Nope. . .the grammatical construction makes "whom" (the Son) the subject of the verb "upholding all things by the word of his power."

    when he had made purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
    Last edited by smoky; 04-05-2017 at 02:47 PM.

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    ...the differentiation made between ho theos as the one who speaks in both eras and huios as his final means of speaking shows that in the author's mind it was not the Triune God of Christian theology who spoke to the forefathers by the prophets. That is to say, for the author of Hebrews (as for all NT writers, one may suggest) "the God of our fathers," Yahweh, was no other than "the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ" (compare Acts 2:30 and 2:33; 3:13 and 3:18; 3:25 and 3:26; note also 5:30). Such a conclusion is entirely consistent with the regular NT usage of ho theos. It would be inappropriate for elohim or YHWH ever to refer to the Trinity in the OT when in the NT theos regularly refers to the Father alone and apparently never to the Trinity.
    (Murray J. Harris, Jesus As God: The New Testament Use of Theos in Reference to Jesus, p. 47, fn 112)
    The hound of Jewish monotheism.

    "For us there is one God. He is the Father." (I Corinthians 8:6)

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    "The question" your logic requires mending, none of your conclusions is of necessity a direct result of the statements.

    You offer no explanation as to the fact that the word used for "one" also includes a unified group.
    A husband and wife can be "one" in the same way as our trinitarian God.
    A troop can march "as one" too. The single item that has been used for your singleness of God is your undoing, the Jewish Shema.

    Mods, this belongs in the Trinitarian forum not the main Bible debate forum.
    Trump's obvious lies make it impossible to believe anything he says that might be true. His presidency is falling apart fast.

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    "Trump's obvious lies make it impossible to believe anything he says that might be true. His presidency is falling apart fast."


    Wait and see what happens

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    http://www.christianthinktank.com/trin01.html

    The most thorough write up explaining the Trinity both within scripture and within the ancient cultures surrounding the issue. But it probably requires far more attention than you are willing to apply to something you disagree with. Since your basis of denying the Trinity is mainly dogmatic and poorly supported.

    I would especially suggest you examine the subsection that goes into the Old Testament
    Trump's obvious lies make it impossible to believe anything he says that might be true. His presidency is falling apart fast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Straightshot View Post
    "Trump's obvious lies make it impossible to believe anything he says that might be true. His presidency is falling apart fast."


    Wait and see what happens
    Good advice, if history is any indication. . .Jesus' ministry also "fell apart very fast" that Passover weekend.

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    Trump is no Messiah.
    fwiw the white house is a single term that includes more than 1000 people, in theory they march with a single tread. But still it is all referred to as a single thing.
    Trump's obvious lies make it impossible to believe anything he says that might be true. His presidency is falling apart fast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theQuestion View Post
    Let's take 'em 2 or 3 at a time~

    Heb 1:1- God, having of old time spoken unto the fathers in the prophets by diverse portions and in divers manners,
    2- hath at the end of these days spoken unto us in His son, whom He appointed


    > NOTICE: APPOINTED, not God spoke thru another God?Person/Nature/Essence<


    heir of all things, through


    > NOTICE: THROUGH. God didn't do it directly. <


    whom also he made the worlds;
    3- who being the effulgence [def= radiant splendor : brilliance] of
    His glory, and the very image of His substance, and upholding all things by the word of His power,


    > NOTICE: He is an image of God, as many sons are of their fathers. He is not one of Three. It's by God's Power! Not his own that he "upholds all things".<


    when he had made purification of sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
    Hi, theQuestion.

    No "trinnie", as far as I know, would not admit to a very clear "order of roles" within the Trinity.

    God the Father appointed God the Son heir of all things

    God the Father, through God the Son, made the worlds.

    God the Son is the image of God the Father.

    God the Son sits at the right hand of God the Father; before that, He was by His side as the Word.
    2Co 11:1 I wish you would bear with me in a little foolishness. Do bear with me!

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